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Thread: Ucool,any plans on buffing old unused heroes? cookie cutter builds are taking over.

  1. #31
    Universal Leader Contributor Level 10 Urtock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dindin View Post
    I tried to break the meta when O2 came out with the pilot O2

    Failed miserably lol

    Tried again with vs r1 when red came out

    Failed again lol



    Turtle is a piece of shit
    Well, VS isnt a meta breaker by herself. Try forest guardian agaisnt turtle. I heard he counters the little fucker

  2. #32
    Diamond Member Contributor Level 9 Dindin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urtock View Post
    Well, VS isnt a meta breaker by herself. Try forest guardian agaisnt turtle. I heard he counters the little fucker
    At start i thought she would be a midline and backline puny mages killer. But i got it wrong lol

    Qoc and mani screw her over and over again

  3. #33
    Universal Leader Contributor Level 10 kingedward's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urtock View Post
    Well, VS isnt a meta breaker by herself. Try forest guardian agaisnt turtle. I heard he counters the little fucker
    too bad we need to R0/1 first "sure/safe" heroes. I left my FG stuck in O2, but Im pretty sure he can do good dmg vs TF and SH teams. Just maybe needs a push of a MR debuffer

    but same, first have priorities, when Ive left priorities aside to gamble in other heroes I can get stuck in arenas for 1 week, and I hate that. I hope they dont release R2 soon so we have enuff time to try more heroes.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by HenryChinaski View Post
    So...how does Meta changes? Can only be that:
    1) new hero is released - from the newer ones (free for all) itīs pretty much only RF really worth
    2) older heroes become great with max gear - here are quite a lot examples: SH,DM,AS,CK,Cleric,etc

    So pretty much that what a lot requests - happens already to a certain extend

    And about farming SS and gearing up - yes, that takes time and now imagine how much time it would take doing that for 85 heroes - as you may need all of them to counter certain Setups (if all are like equal good)



    having 85 also does not mean all can work - it is clear that some heroes counter other - and that is happening already...

    Now imagine how it will be with 85 heroes - all equal good - as this is what you requesting....you need all 85 heroes to have proper counters....

    Or do you want that it just does not matter - throw in 5 of any hero and the Team with more luck wins or only depending on lvl/power/gear?


    If not, there will again be a handful of very good Combos - people will again focus on that and you will have again people not able to Counter (as they do not have necessary counters ready) and complain.

    you arguments give me so much headache, i dont even want to call them arguments....

    1) an new hero released, is op in some manner, maybe makes a setup op (first meta change)
    THEN
    maybe, just maybe, someone finds a good counter against this team and the meta suddenly changes to this counter team

    the only problem is that this doenst rly happen that often

    2) i call bullshit, of your list only SH is a good one which scaled with max gear
    cleric is used in tank/heal-def-teams and he is in use 'cause he got a legendary upgrade (plus its the setup that carries him, if these kind of teams still exist)

    and when im going on to read your writings im pretty much sure of the fact that you dont want to get it at all

    i NEVER wanted to alle be the same and ALL matches be decided by pure luck


    theres a HUGE difference in making all heroes strong/op and in making heroes >USEFULL< (90% of the older heroes are just useless)

    there are some ppl (like me) who like some heroes for their look/skill, but cant use them at all bc they suck as hell, and there are heroes that i cant stand (for instance TF) but have to use them, bc op as fck

    with every new hero that comes more and more old heroes have less and less chance to shine

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcilic View Post
    you arguments give me so much headache, i dont even want to call them arguments....

    1) an new hero released, is op in some manner, maybe makes a setup op (first meta change)
    THEN
    maybe, just maybe, someone finds a good counter against this team and the meta suddenly changes to this counter team

    the only problem is that this doenst rly happen that often

    2) i call bullshit, of your list only SH is a good one which scaled with max gear
    cleric is used in tank/heal-def-teams and he is in use 'cause he got a legendary upgrade (plus its the setup that carries him, if these kind of teams still exist)

    and when im going on to read your writings im pretty much sure of the fact that you dont want to get it at all

    i NEVER wanted to alle be the same and ALL matches be decided by pure luck


    theres a HUGE difference in making all heroes strong/op and in making heroes >USEFULL< (90% of the older heroes are just useless)

    there are some ppl (like me) who like some heroes for their look/skill, but cant use them at all bc they suck as hell, and there are heroes that i cant stand (for instance TF) but have to use them, bc op as fck

    with every new hero that comes more and more old heroes have less and less chance to shine
    Case in point:
    Sniper
    Pilot
    Poisoned One
    Wizard Doctor
    Lightning Master
    Psychic Sword
    Ferryman
    Warrior Monk
    Mountain
    Savage One
    Wandering Spearman
    Deathgore
    Drunken Master
    Stormlord
    Ice Spirit
    etc

  6. #36
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    Ahh.. Stupid phone.. Can't delete same post..

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcilic View Post
    2) i call bullshit, of your list only SH is a good one which scaled with max gear
    cleric is used in tank/heal-def-teams and he is in use 'cause he got a legendary upgrade (plus its the setup that carries him, if these kind of teams still exist)

    Well, if you say out of SH,RF,DM,AS,CK,Cleric only SH is good - we really donīt need to talk any further....

    Guess you are not in a state to use or fight r1 DM, red/r1 RF, r1 AS, red CK,etc....
    as if so, you would know better...so pointless

  8. #38
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    damn kid, you rly have some serious problems there, dont you?

    "SH,DM,AS,CK,Cleric," your list and suddenly you talk about rose fencer? i lol@ya man

    killed AS r1 - ez going, LB does his job

    CK - never seen again, since the CK/SH/HN comp wasnt used anymore

    killed DM r1 - yeah, dont need to say much, a legendary that increases his crit

    you should start to work on your shitty attitude there, if you dont want the old ones to be buffed, YOU dont want it, but stop tellin US that they dont need anything and to let 'em die

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcilic View Post
    damn kid, you rly have some serious problems there, dont you?

    "SH,DM,AS,CK,Cleric," your list and suddenly you talk about rose fencer? i lol@ya man

    killed AS r1 - ez going, LB does his job

    CK - never seen again, since the CK/SH/HN comp wasnt used anymore

    killed DM r1 - yeah, dont need to say much, a legendary that increases his crit

    you should start to work on your shitty attitude there, if you dont want the old ones to be buffed, YOU dont want it, but stop tellin US that they dont need anything and to let 'em die
    DM - death mage...

  10. #40
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    ok, when dm = death mage, then sry, my bad, she truly is a beast

  11. #41
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    So getting back on point - I think that balancing 80+ characters may be a herculean task for ucool. I'm not saying that I don't want balance (who doesn't?) but it is a question of resources and incentives. Do they have the people (and enough of them) to look at each hero and see how they can be buffed/nerfed, while communicating said buff/nerf to the team that creates new heroes? To be honest I don't think they have the resources to do so.

    second point - incentives. Ucool's revenue comes from vip players. They need to create an incentive for people to pay for vip status. Mostly this segment of the players are "play to win" so they create new heroes to give these players a leg up. If everything was perfectly balanced, what incentive is there for the vip players to continue "paying to win?" Regardless of how people may feel about p2w players, they are the reason ucool has the money to continue developing this game that we all enjoy.

    So let's think outside the box. How about if there was a third arena created, where each day there is a theme? For example, Monday could be females only, Tuesdays males only, Wednesday intelligence heroes only, etc. this would encourage the use of a diverse group of heroes and it would be very difficult for someone to remain on top of the leaderboards for each theme. People will have to strategize who to invest in and we may see the increased use of heroes like psychopath as an intelligence tank or bear warrior as an agility tank.

    Just my 2 cents...

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chosun One View Post
    So getting back on point - I think that balancing 80+ characters may be a herculean task for ucool. I'm not saying that I don't want balance (who doesn't?) but it is a question of resources and incentives. Do they have the people (and enough of them) to look at each hero and see how they can be buffed/nerfed, while communicating said buff/nerf to the team that creates new heroes? To be honest I don't think they have the resources to do so.

    second point - incentives. Ucool's revenue comes from vip players. They need to create an incentive for people to pay for vip status. Mostly this segment of the players are "play to win" so they create new heroes to give these players a leg up. If everything was perfectly balanced, what incentive is there for the vip players to continue "paying to win?" Regardless of how people may feel about p2w players, they are the reason ucool has the money to continue developing this game that we all enjoy.

    So let's think outside the box. How about if there was a third arena created, where each day there is a theme? For example, Monday could be females only, Tuesdays males only, Wednesday intelligence heroes only, etc. this would encourage the use of a diverse group of heroes and it would be very difficult for someone to remain on top of the leaderboards for each theme. People will have to strategize who to invest in and we may see the increased use of heroes like psychopath as an intelligence tank or bear warrior as an agility tank.

    Just my 2 cents...
    I agree if this is just a game that is play and go.
    Why bother investing the time to balance everything it they only expect players to play for less than 1 year?
    But this game has potential to be longer term.

    There are other ways to make money.
    Add skins. Add wearable gear. Add a chest to buy gear for your heroes. Create seasonal gear and pay-to-participate events. Gamble-style events to win big prizes.
    Add options to buy rebalanced heroes. Remake some heroes where needed to keep the game fresh and original.

    If the game is balanced and fun, the players will stay. At the moment, it's fun, but imbalanced and so many players have left or are looking to the next option.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by PiripiP View Post
    I agree if this is just a game that is play and go.
    Why bother investing the time to balance everything it they only expect players to play for less than 1 year?
    But this game has potential to be longer term.

    There are other ways to make money.
    Add skins. Add wearable gear. Add a chest to buy gear for your heroes. Create seasonal gear and pay-to-participate events. Gamble-style events to win big prizes.
    Add options to buy rebalanced heroes. Remake some heroes where needed to keep the game fresh and original.

    If the game is balanced and fun, the players will stay. At the moment, it's fun, but imbalanced and so many players have left or are looking to the next option.
    Yeah, I agree ucool needs to find a sweet spot. Games like WoW eventually lose steam because it is always about the grind. It would be great if ucool could find a new model to keep players engaged.

    I like the idea of skins - it doesn't ruin the balance of the game but allows people to invest in customizing their favorite heroes. I also like that idea of pay-to-participate events. Perhaps it f2p players can accumulate points that can go towards those events, while other people can pay money to access them. I tried to play a little bit of One Piece Treasure Cruise and one thing they had were special events and challenges (certain amount of dmg done, etc.) and sometime those challenges had bonuses or penalties for certain heroes. Maybe we can compile a list of what works and doesn't work for other games that hopefully ucool can implement into heroes charge.

    Ideas like this could help increase the usage of the older heroes and also give ucool an incentive to rework them.

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